The article I posted sums up most of my responce, but I would like to say a few things in Bill Joy's defense here...

First off it is important that, no matter how you feel about his assertions, you respect the man, because he has done more than almost any other technologist to earn it...he is the creator of bsd unix, that legacy can be seen today in freebsd, openbsd, netbsd, mac OS-X, Tru64 (formerly digital unix), AIX and more...infact code from BSD is in almost every operating system to date, including solaris, all the windows operating systems, irix, you name it...he also made solaris, arguably one of the most advanced operating systems to date...

He also made, vi, csh, and many many other unix tools we take for granted every day...

But none of that makes him right by default, he's still human and thus subject to error...

But the one thing I am going to address here is the comment that implies he has not given back to the comumnity, read the list above, or go search google for a more inclusive list...he has given so very much to the community that I feel that implication was unwarranted...you would be hard pressed to use a modern computer that does not contain something from his legacy and he is only in his 40's...

Thats all I basically had to say, for the record I dont agree with all his assertions, but I do respect his opinion...

--Abaddon

Decius wrote:
] ] But what will get the scientific community to accept being
] ] told what to do?
] ]
] ] Catastrophe. We have scientists saying they want to publish
]
] ] pathogen gene sequences on the Net. One consequential
] ] accident and we'll want to throw those researchers in jail.
]
] Bill Joy has more to say about how information should not be
] free. A lot of the comments in here really piss me off. He
] offers that no one who disagrees with him has a well thought
] out perspective. He also makes the generational spin:
]
] ] I benefited a lot from earlier generations' sacrifice in
] setting
] ] up the system so I could be as creative as I wanted to. It
] was a
] ] part of me giving back.
]
] Giving back how? By creating a future where the next
] generation cannot be as creative because they aren't allowed
] to learn about, say, UNIX because they could use such
] information to harm someone important or powerful who relies
] on said technology to run infrastructure? OK, maybe not UNIX,
] maybe, say, how to fly an airplane?
]
] In history, how many times have wealthy aristocrats peered out
] of their castle windows down at the unwashed masses and
] reacted with fear? How many have said, "We've got to prevent
] these people from getting access to knowledge. We've got to
] prevent these people from getting access to resources. If
] these people got powerful there is no telling what they might
] do!" The fact is that we have gone through this over and over
] and over again in history, and it is well understood at this
] point that this is counter productive to everyone but the
] aristocrat. If this arguement was made by anyone else we would
] either be angry or we would be ignoring it. Shame on those who
] agree to go along this time simply because "its Bill Joy."
]
] Bill Joy is wrong.

abaddon wrote:
] First off it is important that, no matter how you feel about
] his assertions, you respect the man,

Oh certainly. I have the utmost respect for Joy as a technologist.

] But the one thing I am going to address here is the comment
] that implies he has not given back to the comumnity,

You misread what I wrote. In the interview, he specifically explains that he wrote this essay in order to give back to the community, and he does this in the context of appreciating the creative environment that his forefathers built. I responded to that comment specifically. This has absolutely no relationship to anything else that he might have or have not given back to the community, and in no way implies that he has not contributed to the community in other ways. This is a very specific response to a very clear comment that he made.