Rattle wrote:
Heh.. It was a marketing campaign. Adult Swim paralyzed Boston. I don't care what anyone says, this is funny as hell. I mean, everyone know that having LEDs in the shape of a cartoon character is the perfect way to disguise an IED...

Actually, no, it's not that funny. Like it or not we do live in a time when people blow shit up for the purpose of garnering attention. I've seen one ATHF episode (which was one more than I ever care to) and couldn't tell you any of the characters beyond the fact that there's a box of fries with a beard. It's an inside joke that maybe 5% of the US population would get, but it's not really a joke because of how they were placed. It's one thing to put them on a wall or an awning, like some were done, but the ones on the bridges... I have no sympathy for the guy that got arrested for this. I'm all about freedom of expression and freedom of speech, but you have to understand the possible impact, like yelling %22fire!%22 in a crowded theater.

Dolemite

Another view on it here.

My favorite part:

5. The FCC can't pull a private cable network's license, Mayor Hyperbole McFuckwit.

Dolemite wrote:

Rattle wrote:
Heh.. It was a marketing campaign. Adult Swim paralyzed Boston. I don't care what anyone says, this is funny as hell. I mean, everyone know that having LEDs in the shape of a cartoon character is the perfect way to disguise an IED...

Actually, no, it's not that funny. Like it or not we do live in a time when people blow shit up for the purpose of garnering attention. I've seen one ATHF episode (which was one more than I ever care to) and couldn't tell you any of the characters beyond the fact that there's a box of fries with a beard. It's an inside joke that maybe 5% of the US population would get, but it's not really a joke because of how they were placed. It's one thing to put them on a wall or an awning, like some were done, but the ones on the bridges... I have no sympathy for the guy that got arrested for this. I'm all about freedom of expression and freedom of speech, but you have to understand the possible impact, like yelling %22fire!%22 in a crowded theater.

Dolemite

Dolemite wrote:
Actually, no, it's not that funny.

No, really, it is. It's funny.

I have no sympathy for the guy that got arrested for this... like yelling "fire!" in a crowded theater.

You simply cannot send people to prison because you didn't get a joke. Yelling "fire" in a crowded theater involves an intent as well as an act. If you yell "I want that man fired" and a bunch of people mishear you and freak out should you go to jail? These were not intended to be viewed as a threat, and they have been up all over the country for weeks without anyone thinking twice about it. The police need to be able to "take every precaution" without simultaneously demanding heads in exchange for it.

Decius wrote:
You simply cannot send people to prison because you didn't get a joke. Yelling %22fire%22 in a crowded theater involves an intent as well as an act. If you yell %22I want that man fired%22 and a bunch of people mishear you and freak out should you go to jail? These were not intended to be viewed as a threat, and they have been up all over the country for weeks without anyone thinking twice about it. The police need to be able to %22take every precaution%22 without simultaneously demanding heads in exchange for it.

Intent is not always required, which is why we have terms like 'criminal negligence,' or in plain speak, 'you were too stupid to think about the possible consequences of your actions.' Many of the arguments I've heard have been, 'It was a cartoon character!' Well, kind of. It was a bunch of LEDs with the wires visibly exposed and again, it was an inside joke limited to a small subset of the population. Sadly, if the 'artist' had done a better job of tidying up his cables so that it was just a lit box, this probably wouldn't have happened. Next time replace the WALK/DO NOT WALK masks in crossing lights with these things and there won't be as much of a stink.

Again, I only find fault with the guy placing them underneath interstate bridges in an effort to hide them, which is what brought the well deserved suspicion to the devices.

Dolemite

Dolemite wrote:
Next time replace the WALK/DO NOT WALK masks in crossing lights with these things and there won't be as much of a stink.

Again, I only find fault with the guy placing them underneath interstate bridges in an effort to hide them, which is what brought the well deserved suspicion to the devices.

You're kidding, right? Replacing the WALK/DO NOT WALK masks would actually be something that could injure someone (a stupid person, yes, but still). It definitely shows INTENT to do something malicious. Hanging a lighted poster on ANYTHING hardly shows either. It shows intent to get noticed. Just like any other posted bill or advertisement.

Putting one on the underside of a bridge was probably due to the inability to put it anywhere else on the bridge without getting caught in the act. The fact that people over reacted in a 'post 9/11 world' to this genius stunt is indicative of just how massively the terrorists have won. I'd like to see Boston try and recoup its $700K(?!) from their own stupidity.

And let's not forget that if Homeland Security actually worked the way it was supposed to, then Boston should've been able to communicate to other major markets that this was a hoax and prevent them from over reacting as well. Has that happened? That quarter of a trillion dollars was well spent, eh?

flynn23 wrote:
You're kidding, right? Replacing the WALK/DO NOT WALK masks would actually be something that could injure someone (a stupid person, yes, but still). It definitely shows INTENT to do something malicious. Hanging a lighted poster on ANYTHING hardly shows either. It shows intent to get noticed. Just like any other posted bill or advertisement.

This wasn't a lighted poster - it was an electronic device, simple as it may be, with exposed wires. Yes, it sucks that this is the age when people blow shit up, but that's the reality. It was simply a stupid thing to do. Period.

Dolemite

Dolemite wrote:

flynn23 wrote:
You're kidding, right? Replacing the WALK/DO NOT WALK masks would actually be something that could injure someone (a stupid person, yes, but still). It definitely shows INTENT to do something malicious. Hanging a lighted poster on ANYTHING hardly shows either. It shows intent to get noticed. Just like any other posted bill or advertisement.

This wasn't a lighted poster - it was an electronic device, simple as it may be, with exposed wires. Yes, it sucks that this is the age when people blow shit up, but that's the reality. It was simply a stupid thing to do. Period.

Dolemite

I suggest you go on Flickr and look at one of these things for yourself, nice and close up. They don't look like bombs and they have no particularly exposed wires.

Let me repeat, they don't look a bit like bombs. Don't make excuses for administration's stupidity.

Dolemite wrote:

flynn23 wrote:
You're kidding, right? Replacing the WALK/DO NOT WALK masks would actually be something that could injure someone (a stupid person, yes, but still). It definitely shows INTENT to do something malicious. Hanging a lighted poster on ANYTHING hardly shows either. It shows intent to get noticed. Just like any other posted bill or advertisement.

This wasn't a lighted poster - it was an electronic device, simple as it may be, with exposed wires. Yes, it sucks that this is the age when people blow shit up, but that's the reality. It was simply a stupid thing to do. Period.

So is a neon sign in a window a lighted advertisement or an electronic device? If you were to find a neon sign in a random location, would you assume that it had lethal force? What about the iPod ads in bus stops? They're electronic devices, right? If it's simply exposed wires which tips the scale, then every cable/telecom junction box hanging from a telephone pole is a potential IED.

I have to disagree that this was stupid. I think it was genius and has probably worked well beyond the original creator's dreams in terms of its sole and original purpose: get people interested in ATHF. You know that Paris Hilton and Donald Trump are seething with envy right now.

And let's not forget that if Homeland Security actually worked the way it was supposed to, then Boston should've been able to communicate to other major markets that this was a hoax and prevent them from over reacting as well. Has that happened? That quarter of a trillion dollars was well spent, eh?

Hell, the blind panic even started to spread to Chicago, who knew about the devices, knew what they were, and went back to reexamine the issue of what they were after Boston started panicking.

Dolemite wrote:
Intent is not always required, which is why we have terms like 'criminal negligence,' or in plain speak, 'you were too stupid to think about the possible consequences of your actions.' Many of the arguments I've heard have been, 'It was a cartoon character!' Well, kind of. It was a bunch of LEDs with the wires visibly exposed and again, it was an inside joke limited to a small subset of the population.

I just don't see it in the same light. There are three possible scenarios here.
1. They're bombs.
2. They're art.
3. They're bombs that are also art.

In this case as they have a character on them that clearly resembles something from a video game, you have to eliminate option number 1.

Either they are art, or they are bombs that are also art.

Who places bombs that are also art? Certainly not Al'Queda. They are not that silly, so everyone yapping about a post 9/11 environment is on the wrong side of this.

Do people sometimes do this? As Rattle pointed out, yes, it can happen, but the kind of people who do this are seriously mentally ill. Its extremely rare, and its not a sign of the times, as mental illness knows no geopolitical context.

Either these police were dealing with one of the most bizarre criminal masterminds of all time, or its just art. There are four things that you can do in this situation.

1. Assume that the signs are just art, and leave them alone.
2. Assume that the signs are just art, but pull them down because they aren't supposed to be there.
3. Assume that the signs are just art, but destroy them anyway out of an abundance of caution.
4. Assume you are dealing with one of the most bizarre criminal masterminds of all time and act accordingly.

Based on the retoric that was coming out of the Police and the Government in Boston, its absolutely clear that they chose door number 4. I cannot sympathize. I can understand choosing door number 3, but that means accepting that the people who put the signs up didn't mean any harm. I don't think its criminally negligent to assume that people won't think they living in a comic book story. These things were up all around the country for weeks prior to this incident.

Now, placing these signs around is illegal, and the people who did it knew that it was illegal. Given that the police did get involved, its not unreasonable to charge them with the crime that they actually committed (which, frankly, is the most harmless sort of vandalism possible given that the things can simply be plucked right off the wall).

Thats not what is going here. To quote Noteworthy, they are still calling these "hoax devices," as if they still don't understand what happened. They are charging these people with the same crime they'd be charged with had they purposefully operated a bomb hoax. Putting a bunch of signs up that someone confuses for a bomb is not the same thing as putting a bunch devices up that are designed purposefully to be confused with a bomb.

Decius wrote:
Thats not what is going here. To quote Noteworthy, they are still calling these 'hoax devices,' as if they still don't understand what happened. They are charging these people with the same crime they'd be charged with had they purposefully operated a bomb hoax. Putting a bunch of signs up that someone confuses for a bomb is not the same thing as putting a bunch devices up that are designed purposefully to be confused with a bomb.

[ This was the point i made (in a different thread... i didn't know this one existed). Using the term 'hoax' is wrong and deliberately misleading because it implies that these were intended to be mistaken as bombs, which they clearly were not.

Charge the guy with low grade vandalism and move on. I really can't see how anyone in their right mind thought this was some kind of giant Al Quaeda plot to blow up bridges.

A bit stupid? Yes. Criminal? Hardly.

I agree with Flynn32 and I've said it before : all it takes for the terrorists to win is for citizens to live with a constant sense of fear. That is the point. Not an ancillary point, not an added 'benefit', but the point of terrorism. It's to make us so afraid to live our lives as free people that we stop doing so.

It's working.

To analogize to the kind of war everyone seems to think we're still fighting, every time someone says 'Well, that's just the world we live in,' we give a little ground. Every time a politician argues for 'security' over any kind of freedom, a breach is opened in our defences. Everytime a law is passed that infringes civil liberties, our infrastructure suffers a massive blow.

This mentality of fear will destroy our society every bit as thouroughly as a global thermonuclear war, just more slowly. And in many ways, it'll be all the more painful, because we'll get to watch ourselves die. We'll get to see the cancer wreak it's havoc until the body collapses.

Fear is a cancer of the mind.

Intent is not always required, which is why we have terms like 'criminal negligence,' or in plain speak, 'you were too stupid to think about the possible consequences of your actions.' Many of the arguments I've heard have been, 'It was a cartoon character!' Well, kind of. It was a bunch of LEDs with the wires visibly exposed and again, it was an inside joke limited to a small subset of the population. Sadly, if the 'artist' had done a better job of tidying up his cables so that it was just a lit box, this probably wouldn't have happened. Next time replace the WALK/DO NOT WALK masks in crossing lights with these things and there won't be as much of a stink.

Again, I only find fault with the guy placing them underneath interstate bridges in an effort to hide them, which is what brought the well deserved suspicion to the devices.

Dolemite

You seriously might want to take a moment and actually read the crap you are typing. You may want to consider changing your stance on this, because so far, every single reason you've cited as to why you feel the ATHF camp are at fault, is more applicable to the Boston Police.

This is at best a case of a policeman or two who felt he could make a name for himself and get some press time by blowing something completely out of proportion so there would a "major crime" to investigate. At worst, it's a police force incapable of using reasonable judgement, and too stupid to be able to research what it is they're looking at before declaring that it's a bomb.

The devices did not look like bombs.

The devices were not placed under overpasses and bridges exclusively as the terror-vending media would have had people believe.

The devices had actually been around for awhile now, in many other major metropolitan cities, in exactly the same types of locations, with no one having a stroke over it.

For that matter, why the hell would someone be trying to hide an advertisement that lights up.

Dolemite wrote:

Rattle wrote:
Heh.. It was a marketing campaign. Adult Swim paralyzed Boston. I don't care what anyone says, this is funny as hell. I mean, everyone know that having LEDs in the shape of a cartoon character is the perfect way to disguise an IED...

Actually, no, it's not that funny. Like it or not we do live in a time when people blow shit up for the purpose of garnering attention. I've seen one ATHF episode (which was one more than I ever care to) and couldn't tell you any of the characters beyond the fact that there's a box of fries with a beard. It's an inside joke that maybe 5% of the US population would get, but it's not really a joke because of how they were placed. It's one thing to put them on a wall or an awning, like some were done, but the ones on the bridges... I have no sympathy for the guy that got arrested for this. I'm all about freedom of expression and freedom of speech, but you have to understand the possible impact, like yelling %22fire!%22 in a crowded theater.

Dolemite

The Boston Police were yelling "bomb" in a crowded city.

Rattle wrote:

Bomb units scrambled across Boston and Somerville today to investigate several suspicious devices.

The reports forced the temporary shutdowns of Interstate 93 out of the city, a key inbound roadway, a bridge between Boston and Cambridge, and a portion of the Charles River but were quickly determined not to be explosive.

"It's a hoax -- and it's not funny," Gov. Deval Patrick said.

Officials at Mayor Menino's office say the devices appear to resemble a cartoon character. It could be related to characters from the cartoon, "Aqua Teen Hunger Force."

This is right up there with the smiley face bomber.

Heh.. It was a marketing campaign. Adult Swim paralyzed Boston. I don't care what anyone says, this is funny as hell. I mean, everyone know that having LEDs in the shape of a cartoon character is the perfect way to disguise an IED...

Hey Boston, thanks for giving in to Terrorism... you dumbasses.

Rattle wrote:

Bomb units scrambled across Boston and Somerville today to investigate several suspicious devices.

The reports forced the temporary shutdowns of Interstate 93 out of the city, a key inbound roadway, a bridge between Boston and Cambridge, and a portion of the Charles River but were quickly determined not to be explosive.

"It's a hoax -- and it's not funny," Gov. Deval Patrick said.

Officials at Mayor Menino's office say the devices appear to resemble a cartoon character. It could be related to characters from the cartoon, "Aqua Teen Hunger Force."

This is right up there with the smiley face bomber.

Heh.. It was a marketing campaign. Adult Swim paralyzed Boston. I don't care what anyone says, this is funny as hell. I mean, everyone know that having LEDs in the shape of a cartoon character is the perfect way to disguise an IED...

The Ebay auctions for some of these that have been recovered have all been yanked. They were going for upwards of $5K a piece last I saw.

Perhaps the best part of this entire saga is going to be the episode of ATHF that lampoons Boston. My money is that Carl plays the Boston cop which called in the bomb squad when he couldn't figure out what the hell it was. I can't wait.

Decius wrote:

Bomb units scrambled across Boston and Somerville today to investigate several suspicious devices.

"It's a hoax -- and it's not funny," Gov. Deval Patrick said.

This is an extremely serious situation," former FBI Director Bill Gavin told FOX News during the investigation.

"Whoever did this — whether it be kids or adults — if they think it's funny, I think they'll soon learn it's not that much of a humorous situation."

What a bunch of idiots!

It gets worse. The stupid has spread to other cities now.

RE: cbs4boston.com - Hoax Devices Creating Gridlock In Boston

Dagmar wrote:

Decius wrote:

Bomb units scrambled across Boston and Somerville today to investigate several suspicious devices.

"It's a hoax -- and it's not funny," Gov. Deval Patrick said.

This is an extremely serious situation," former FBI Director Bill Gavin told FOX News during the investigation.

"Whoever did this — whether it be kids or adults — if they think it's funny, I think they'll soon learn it's not that much of a humorous situation."

What a bunch of idiots!

It gets worse. The stupid has spread to other cities now.

Wow. What's more stupid? The ridiculous over reaction by law enforcement to what amounts to graffiti? Or this chodes' description of it?

Look, I'm a 39 year old middle aged housewife MOM, and I 'got the joke.' I know my ATHF characters. ATHF rules, and this is just a typical police reaction - THEY couldn't have possibly been wrong, and THEY cannot stand for anyone to laugh at their expense, so someone MUST go to jail.

Scaredy cats. It is a darn litebright.

Those people over at bookcrossings better quit leaving books around too - lord knows that is litering and you can always hollow out the inside of a book with an exacto knife and put a bomb in there.

Books and cartoon characters kill 'in this day and age.'
GAD I am so SICK of hearing that. When is 'this day and age' going to be over, or do we have to be scared forever?

skullaria wrote:
Books and cartoon characters kill 'in this day and age.'
GAD I am so SICK of hearing that. When is 'this day and age' going to be over, or do we have to be scared forever?

[ See above... it is intended by many that you, and the rest of us, be scared forever. The only way to not be scared is to not be scared. I might die from an exploding person or even book. I might get anthrax or smallpox (or god knows what) from an attack on the CDC labs in my neighborhood or a bio attack somewhere else.

I *could* get struck by lightning or killed in a car wreck. But I don't allow myself to live in constant fear of these things. I take reasonable precautions and live my life with a minimum of anxiety.

Sounds like you're on the same page... now we've just gotta get the rest of the country on board. -k]

skullaria wrote:
Scaredy cats. It is a darn litebright.

Alright, skullaria gets props in my book from throwing down the Lite Brite reference.

...

(could never make that stupid clown...)

Acidus wrote:
(could never make that stupid clown...)

Well, you're never too old to give it another try.