| |
RAND Forum on Hydrogen Technology and Policy
by noteworthy at 8:22 am EDT, Jul 19, 2005 |
This might be of interest to our resident energy experts. Hydrogen as an energy carrier has generated much attention due to its potential large-scale use in producing electrical energy through fuel-cell technologies and in replacing gasoline for use in transportation. On December 9, 2004, the RAND Corporation hosted a forum that drew 40 experts in various fields to discuss what needs to be done to better inform decisionmakers in the public and private sectors of the benefits and risks of various hydrogen-related programs and policies. The document summarizes the proceedings of that forum. Forum participants identified the following potential benefits of hydrogen, which warrant further examination and assessment:
• Introducing hydrogen as an alternative energy source could add diversity to the supply of transportation fuels, thereby making the United States less dependent on petroleum and making fuel costs more stable and predictable.
• If hydrogen-based fuel cells were put to use generating electricity on a small scale close to areas where electricity is needed, the burden on the current electric grid—the system that generates and distributes electricity—could be eased.
• If renewable energy is used to make hydrogen, fuel cells could provide a means of storing renewable electricity—something that cannot be done today.
• If communities and companies had the ability to generate their own electricity via small fuel cells using renewable energy to make hydrogen, they could fulfill their energy needs locally and would not have to depend as much on imported energy.
• Private companies that develop innovative technologies for using hydrogen as an alternative energy source have the potential to become highly profitable, world-class technology leaders.
• Developing nations that put hydrogen to work right away could leapfrog over the environmentally
destructive practices that have occurred in other countries.
• Reducing the use of petroleum could also reduce the environmental impacts of exploring for, producing, transporting, and refining petroleum, including the potential contamination of groundwater and surface water.
|
| |
RE: RAND Forum on Hydrogen Technology and Policy
by paul at 10:08 pm EDT, Jul 19, 2005 |
Only problem is that Hydrogen is not an energy source. It is merely an energy storage medium. Unless you plan to take a trip to the sun/outer planets to get some, you cann't find elemental hydrogen in nature. There are plenty of ways of storing energy produced, but what we need is a way to produce it clean and cheap. All the government funded R&D on a hydrogen powered car is a huge waste of time and resources. The hybrids being produced are making money while developing the same technologies without government subsidy and saving energy now! Hydrogen as an energy storage medium is pretty lousy. It requires great pressure or exotic compounds and still does not contain the energy density of hydrocarbon fuels. |
|
| | |
RE: RAND Forum on Hydrogen Technology and Policy
by noteworthy at 11:13 pm EDT, Jul 19, 2005 |
paul wrote:
Only problem is that Hydrogen is not an energy source. It is merely an energy storage medium.
Paul, do you think RAND doesn't know that? Did you read this report? Did you even look at the first page of the summary? The authors make this point on the very first page: Hydrogen is referred to as an energy carrier because, like electricity, it needs to be made from a primary energy source, such as natural gas.
|
|
| | | |
RE: RAND Forum on Hydrogen Technology and Policy
by paul at 11:01 pm EDT, Jul 21, 2005 |
Looking at the bullet point summary-it is either misleading or nonsensical:
" Introducing hydrogen as an alternative energy source could add diversity to the supply of transportation fuels, thereby making the United States less dependent on petroleum and making fuel costs more stable and predictable."
B.S. it is not an energy source-alternative or otherwise "If hydrogen-based fuel cells were put to use generating electricity on a small scale close to areas where electricity is needed, the burden on the current electric grid—the system that generates and distributes electricity—could be eased."
Again ridiculous. Cheaper and more effective to ship natural gas than to waste energy producing hydrogen and shipping the hydrogen. " If renewable energy is used to make hydrogen, fuel cells could provide a means of storing renewable electricity—something that cannot be done today."
at least acknowledges that we are only talking about a storage medium. Why use such an expensive bulky medium? Current methods of storing electricity are batteries, flywheel or pumped storage(large scale power plant use. More ideal storage would be conversion to liquid fuel. Currently natural gas to alcohol is possible. "If communities and companies had the ability to generate their own electricity via small fuel cells using renewable energy to make hydrogen, they could fulfill their energy needs locally and would not have to depend as much on imported energy.
• Private companies that develop innovative technologies for using hydrogen as an alternative energy source have the potential to become highly profitable, world-class technology leaders.
• Developing nations that put hydrogen to work right away could leapfrog over the environmentally
destructive practices that have occurred in other countries.
• Reducing the use of petroleum could also reduce the environmental impacts of exploring for, producing, transporting, and refining petroleum, including the potential contamination of groundwater and surface water."
All these ignor the fact that the breakthrough needed is cheap production of energy from a renewable source. Hydrogen as a storage medium is a minor part of the equation. Any environmental benefits are derived soley from the method of energy generation and not from the hydrogen. |
|
|
|
