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This page contains all of the posts and discussion on MemeStreams referencing the following web page: Home Market Takes a Tumble. You can find discussions on MemeStreams as you surf the web, even if you aren't a MemeStreams member, using the Threads Bookmarklet.

Home Market Takes a Tumble
by possibly noteworthy at 6:27 am EDT, May 10, 2011

Nick Timiraos and Dawn Wotapka:

Home values fell 3% in the first quarter from the previous quarter and 1.1% in March from the previous month, pushed down by an abundance of foreclosed homes on the market, according to data to be released Monday by real-estate website Zillow.com. Prices have now fallen for 57 consecutive months, according to Zillow.

Stan Humphries, Zillow's chief economist, now believes prices won't hit bottom before next year and expects they will fall by another 7% to 9%.

While some analysts have argued that home prices need to fall to "clearing prices" that will attract more buyers, price declines could also complicate any recovery by pushing more borrowers under water. Zillow estimates that more than 28% of borrowers owe more than their homes are worth nationally. Those numbers are much higher in hard-hit markets such as Phoenix, where more than two-thirds of borrowers owe more than their homes are worth.

Decius:

Imagine if they all walked.

John Bird and John Fortune:

They thought that if they had a bigger mortgage they could get a bigger house. They thought if they had a bigger house, they would be happy. It's pathetic. I've got four houses and I'm not happy.

Decius:

Wow, life is boring.


 
RE: Home Market Takes a Tumble
by Decius at 7:28 am EDT, May 10, 2011

possibly noteworthy wrote:
While some analysts have argued that home prices need to fall to "clearing prices" that will attract more buyers, price declines could also complicate any recovery by pushing more borrowers under water.

I'm starting to get annoyed with the analysts who are talking about how prices are too high.

I felt fairly confident buying my place because at the time, the mortgage payment was comparable to the rent you'd pay on a similarly sized place in the area.

Not anymore. Zillow provides a suggested rent payment and an estimated mortgage payment at current interest rates given their sales price estimate for the place.

The suggested rent is nearly twice the estimated mortgage payment.

What this means is that you could buy my place at the current market price and then rent it out for a yield of 80% or more!

Anyone currently renting stands to save a significant amount of money buying at these prices. Anyone looking for an investment opportunity stands to make a handsome profit.

This means that prices are not too high. Prices have fallen way, way below where they are supposed to be. Commentators who talk about the need to reach "clearing prices" are not providing useful insight into the situation.

We're way past any reasonable concept of a "clearing price" in this market. And prices are still falling.

There are several factors:
1. Economic growth: Atlanta is not growing right now, so there is less need to consume homes.
2. Gridlock: People stuck underwater in their house can't move and so the whole market gets gridlocked.
3. Availability of credit: There are perfectly responsible potential home owners who are not allowed to buy right now because credit restrictions have become more strict than they should be.
4. Fear: No one wants to try to catch a falling knife.

But the number one factor in my mind is foreclosure sales. They are a race to the bottom - past the bottom - with each bank trying to offer their places cheaper than the next bank in an attempt to avoid the load associated with holding onto the properties through a normal sales cycle. This process feeds itself - they've driven the prices so low that the prices are a catalyst for more foreclosures - people who need to leave end up foreclosing because they cannot compete with bank prices. Ultimately, it is the banks that suffer. They're going out of business at unprecedented rates.

The banks aren't going to change tactics until the people who run then - the economists - recognize the reality of the situation for what it is and start making useful recommendations. Instead there is this constant drum beat of "prices are too high" and so financial institutions act accordingly.

Its madness.


  
RE: Home Market Takes a Tumble
by Dagmar at 4:15 pm EDT, May 10, 2011

Decius wrote:

3. Availability of credit: There are perfectly responsible potential home owners who are not allowed to buy right now because credit restrictions have become more strict than they should be.

I disagree about that point. I think the banks aren't lending to people to buying homes because the bank is who is really buying the home, and that asset is going to depreciate further still and leave the bank with as much of an on-paper loss as if the homeowner just trashed the place and walked away from a foreclosure.


   
RE: Home Market Takes a Tumble
by Decius at 8:56 pm EDT, May 10, 2011

Dagmar wrote:

Decius wrote:

3. Availability of credit: There are perfectly responsible potential home owners who are not allowed to buy right now because credit restrictions have become more strict than they should be.

I disagree about that point. I think the banks aren't lending to people to buying homes because the bank is who is really buying the home, and that asset is going to depreciate further still and leave the bank with as much of an on-paper loss as if the homeowner just trashed the place and walked away from a foreclosure.

Thats a very good point.


 
 
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